Comments for the human province http://humanprovince.wordpress.com in the dark, words weigh double Thu, 26 Nov 2009 10:26:00 +0000 http://wordpress.com/ hourly 1 Comment on Palestinian refugees in Lebanon by lirun http://humanprovince.wordpress.com/2009/11/20/palestinian-refugees-lebano/#comment-1003 lirun Thu, 26 Nov 2009 10:26:00 +0000 http://humanprovince.wordpress.com/?p=1256#comment-1003 what do you expect ultra nationalists to say.. won.. think for second.. why dont you go take a poll at a hippie commune.. what do you expect ultra nationalists to say.. won.. think for second.. why dont you go take a poll at a hippie commune..

]]> Comment on Reactions to the Goldstone report by sean http://humanprovince.wordpress.com/2009/09/18/reactions-to-the-goldstone-report/#comment-1002 sean Wed, 25 Nov 2009 07:58:16 +0000 http://humanprovince.wordpress.com/?p=1195#comment-1002 Glad to see you're still as obtuse as ever, ya habibi. Feel free to troll over here as much as you want! Glad to see you’re still as obtuse as ever, ya habibi. Feel free to troll over here as much as you want!

]]> Comment on Reactions to the Goldstone report by m.idrees http://humanprovince.wordpress.com/2009/09/18/reactions-to-the-goldstone-report/#comment-1001 m.idrees Tue, 24 Nov 2009 23:49:35 +0000 http://humanprovince.wordpress.com/?p=1195#comment-1001 What an asinine post. So one of them knows what analogy means and the other is too thick to understand that balance of power is not a function of ethnicity. And the blogger I presume doesn't know what jus ad bellum and jus in bello mean, otherwise he won't have a problem distinguishing Abu Khalil's legitimate criticism (this time, that is, since he <i>can</i> often be reactionary</i>) from Boot's petulant propaganda. What an asinine post. So one of them knows what analogy means and the other is too thick to understand that balance of power is not a function of ethnicity. And the blogger I presume doesn’t know what jus ad bellum and jus in bello mean, otherwise he won’t have a problem distinguishing Abu Khalil’s legitimate criticism (this time, that is, since he can often be reactionary) from Boot’s petulant propaganda.

]]> Comment on Palestinian refugees in Lebanon by Won http://humanprovince.wordpress.com/2009/11/20/palestinian-refugees-lebano/#comment-1000 Won Sun, 22 Nov 2009 11:28:01 +0000 http://humanprovince.wordpress.com/?p=1256#comment-1000 Lirun- Yes, I do realize that it isn't exactly a Gallup poll, but they did survey 6,400 Israelis, which means that more than 3,000 people said "away with the Palestinians!" Lirun- Yes, I do realize that it isn’t exactly a Gallup poll, but they did survey 6,400 Israelis, which means that more than 3,000 people said “away with the Palestinians!”

]]> Comment on War crimes and “openness” by lirun http://humanprovince.wordpress.com/2009/10/21/war-crimes-and-openness/#comment-999 lirun Sun, 22 Nov 2009 09:37:18 +0000 http://humanprovince.wordpress.com/?p=1211#comment-999 and yes even if there was overwhelming support it doesnt mean that a lot of people werent against it at the same time.. u have to leave your desire to debate all the time.. im offering you a window and you keep shutting it.. and yes even if there was overwhelming support it doesnt mean that a lot of people werent against it at the same time..

u have to leave your desire to debate all the time.. im offering you a window and you keep shutting it..

]]> Comment on War crimes and “openness” by lirun http://humanprovince.wordpress.com/2009/10/21/war-crimes-and-openness/#comment-998 lirun Sun, 22 Nov 2009 09:36:04 +0000 http://humanprovince.wordpress.com/?p=1211#comment-998 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SC-nYroSgAc u dont live here and u didnt speak to people.. i have no reason to make it up.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SC-nYroSgAc

u dont live here and u didnt speak to people.. i have no reason to make it up..

]]> Comment on Palestinian refugees in Lebanon by lirun http://humanprovince.wordpress.com/2009/11/20/palestinian-refugees-lebano/#comment-997 lirun Sun, 22 Nov 2009 09:18:58 +0000 http://humanprovince.wordpress.com/?p=1256#comment-997 won - i have not been able to source the ownership of israel national news but based on its regular columns i would suggest that it is not representative of the mainstream but rather of the extreme right who obviously delight in publishing these sorts of polls.. an interesting tale is that channel 7 (your source) wanted to set up an offshore floating radio station like the voice of peace was.. and the government in response apparently changed the relevant laws to prohibit the operation of that station requiring the boat to anchor 12 miles rather than the previous 5 from teh shoreline.. http://www.inn.co.il/News/News.aspx/179075 sean - i think an issue i see with your reasoning is that there is a difference between acknowledging a right and recognising responsibility for cause.. for example - a population may be ravaged by natural disaster and their country of citizenship will be responsible at many levels to ameliorate their situation.. this does not mean that they caused it.. i think there are some interesting arguments that can flow from this in terms of originating responsibility ie if the palos of 48 were subject to british rule - then the brits had a duty to protect them.. to the extent that they failed then perhaps they owe restitution.. if they were citizens of some other entity perhaps that country owed them a duty.. nowtwithstanding any of the above - and blame aside - now as subjects of the state of lebanon (irrespective of citizenship) the state of lebanon has a duty to assure the welfare of these people.. these are complex issues.. and i am fully aware that similar arguments may be mounted towards israel with respect to the welfare of gazans and the residents of the west bank.. i think international law falls short here.. it is based on assumptions that do not hold.. so throwing all of that aside: in connection with the lebanese palestinians i would bein favour of the following: (a) that at the very least they receive full residence.. so they can study any subject of their choice and fully partake in the relevant profession and alleviate poverty.. i think their camps should be officially recognised as towns and relevant infrastructure should be provided.. i think the refugee status issue should be maintained at the personal level ie if someone seeks to register they should but it should not be forced upon everyone.. people should be able to determine whether or not they would like to sacrifice their lives for the national cause.. i dont think the two state solution is dead.. i just think its very very unwell right now.. but i dont believe any other option short of jordan and egypt resuming control of the territories is workable.. i think a land swap is inevitable.. i hope we achieve peace.. even blogging is getting tiring.. won – i have not been able to source the ownership of israel national news but based on its regular columns i would suggest that it is not representative of the mainstream but rather of the extreme right who obviously delight in publishing these sorts of polls..

an interesting tale is that channel 7 (your source) wanted to set up an offshore floating radio station like the voice of peace was.. and the government in response apparently changed the relevant laws to prohibit the operation of that station requiring the boat to anchor 12 miles rather than the previous 5 from teh shoreline..

http://www.inn.co.il/News/News.aspx/179075

sean – i think an issue i see with your reasoning is that there is a difference between acknowledging a right and recognising responsibility for cause.. for example – a population may be ravaged by natural disaster and their country of citizenship will be responsible at many levels to ameliorate their situation.. this does not mean that they caused it..

i think there are some interesting arguments that can flow from this in terms of originating responsibility ie if the palos of 48 were subject to british rule – then the brits had a duty to protect them.. to the extent that they failed then perhaps they owe restitution.. if they were citizens of some other entity perhaps that country owed them a duty..

nowtwithstanding any of the above – and blame aside – now as subjects of the state of lebanon (irrespective of citizenship) the state of lebanon has a duty to assure the welfare of these people..

these are complex issues.. and i am fully aware that similar arguments may be mounted towards israel with respect to the welfare of gazans and the residents of the west bank..

i think international law falls short here.. it is based on assumptions that do not hold..

so throwing all of that aside: in connection with the lebanese palestinians i would bein favour of the following:

(a) that at the very least they receive full residence.. so they can study any subject of their choice and fully partake in the relevant profession and alleviate poverty.. i think their camps should be officially recognised as towns and relevant infrastructure should be provided.. i think the refugee status issue should be maintained at the personal level ie if someone seeks to register they should but it should not be forced upon everyone.. people should be able to determine whether or not they would like to sacrifice their lives for the national cause..

i dont think the two state solution is dead.. i just think its very very unwell right now.. but i dont believe any other option short of jordan and egypt resuming control of the territories is workable..

i think a land swap is inevitable..

i hope we achieve peace.. even blogging is getting tiring..

]]> Comment on Palestinian refugees in Lebanon by Won http://humanprovince.wordpress.com/2009/11/20/palestinian-refugees-lebano/#comment-996 Won Sun, 22 Nov 2009 04:32:43 +0000 http://humanprovince.wordpress.com/?p=1256#comment-996 Also, a very recent poll of the matters: http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/Flash.aspx/174891 Also, a very recent poll of the matters: http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/Flash.aspx/174891

]]> Comment on Palestinian refugees in Lebanon by Won http://humanprovince.wordpress.com/2009/11/20/palestinian-refugees-lebano/#comment-995 Won Sun, 22 Nov 2009 04:20:26 +0000 http://humanprovince.wordpress.com/?p=1256#comment-995 Very clever of Moshe Sharett to frame the Palestinian refugee problem not as their responsibility as the causer of the problem but as a humanitarian initiative, so to speak. Would be too insensitive to say that even Moshe's viewpoint is missed since that Israel DOES seem to "remain indifferent to the suffering and distressed by which the problem is surrounded. "?? Very clever of Moshe Sharett to frame the Palestinian refugee problem not as their responsibility as the causer of the problem but as a humanitarian initiative, so to speak. Would be too insensitive to say that even Moshe’s viewpoint is missed since that Israel DOES seem to “remain indifferent to the suffering and distressed by which the problem is surrounded. “??

]]> Comment on Palestinian refugees in Lebanon by sean http://humanprovince.wordpress.com/2009/11/20/palestinian-refugees-lebano/#comment-994 sean Sat, 21 Nov 2009 09:04:44 +0000 http://humanprovince.wordpress.com/?p=1256#comment-994 Yeah, I mention countries in the region, since those should be the easiest to travel to. I think it's somewhat difficult to get a tourist visa to see the Big Ben or Tour Eiffel whether you've got a Syrian passport, Palestinian travel documents or papers from Yemen. Apparently, though, it's actually easier for a Palestinian refugee to get a tourist visa to India than it is for an American. Yeah, I mention countries in the region, since those should be the easiest to travel to. I think it’s somewhat difficult to get a tourist visa to see the Big Ben or Tour Eiffel whether you’ve got a Syrian passport, Palestinian travel documents or papers from Yemen. Apparently, though, it’s actually easier for a Palestinian refugee to get a tourist visa to India than it is for an American.

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